To see the video of this interview go to: http://www.newrealities.com/index.php/alan-steinfeld/item/1837-my-interview-with-ananta-about-waking-up-to-presense
Ananta (A) I recognized that I was free.
AS) You recognized you were free?
A) I knew I was free, yeah...are you asking me about...
AS) Yeah, you were free from what?
A) Ok, I was in prison, right?
AS – to the camera) Yes. Ananta, she had an experience in a Japanese prison, were she had to be really silent for three years.
A) Yeah, the silence was for about two and an half years.
AS) And it was torture for being...
A) I wasn't being tortured but the situation that I was in was everything I didn't want, right?
So there was...we were working in a factory, everyday, so there was a lot of physical...the body was really pushed to its limits in many ways, and so there was an extreme physical pain going on, and of course mental pain...
AS) ...because you were in prison...
A) ...resisting the experience, always every moment wanting a different experience; the mind was going nuts, always looking at the calendar counting the days, trying to work out...
AS) ...how many more days...
A) ...yeah, I mean, so it was the whole system, was like it had an extreme...And I would say after about one year, or so, of believing myself to be a victim...
AS) ...that's how most people would feel.
A) Yeah, and wanting to die...
AS) ...because this was awful, yeah...
A) ...and physical, complete physical exhaustion. I wasn't sleeping at night. I was just going to lucid dreaming; there was not much sleep happening. And at the end of each day, after the factory, we were not allowed to lean back against the wall or to lay down: we had to sit.
AS) Wow, you did? Why? I mean it's 'cause they...
A)...'cause that's the rules!
AS) You couldn't lean back!
A) So you couldn't lean against the wall except when you knew that they weren't looking, right? So the awareness - this was the interesting part actually - was that there was a game of awareness with awareness, with itself.
There was the awareness of all the guards trying to catch the prisoners to talk or to make one wrong move, and then there was the intensity of awareness of the prisoners waiting for a moment to make the move.
AS) You were aware of both, the guards and the prisoners.
A) Absolutely! Awareness is aware of both, right?
And so there is this intensity of awareness where you were waiting for any moment to quickly speak, or leaning against the wall.
So it's really an intensity and this was getting stronger and stronger and stronger and stronger.
AS) This awareness was getting stronger and stronger?
A) Yes, because if you don't relate, if you don't have any relationship, all the roles fall away. You are no longer a female if there is no male.
AS) You're no longer anything...if you don't relate.
A) You' re no longer anything: there is no role to play.
AS) Right.
A) So then what is left, when there is no role to play?
AS) What was left: just awareness?
A) What is left when there is no role to play?
AS) I guess there is just...I don't know...I'm still playing some roles!
A) Right, so like there is no relating happening, there is only that, and that was getting stronger everyday and then one night....I remember, we were allowed to lay back at 7 p.m....
AS) ...they were being nice...
A) ...no, every night at 7 p.m. we could then lay back.
AS) I see, ok.
A) And this evening, at 7 pm, I laid back and I put these big covers all over the top of me and I just started falling, it was the experience of real.... like all the weight of the body, everything...
I always do this when I'm sharing ( gesture with right hand ).
I always say drop into and through your experience, because this is what happened in that moment: was that the extreme pain of the body - the moment I started to relax - I could feel that pain and I just... it was like I was falling into the pain and through...
AS) ...through the pain...
A) ...the pain and...
AS) ...the pain was no longer the drama of the ...
A) ...no more...
AS) ...you were aware but you weren't fighting it...
A) I was experiencing in it, but just falling through the body pain; falling, falling, falling, falling like...
Now I always say the mind is moving like that fall through the layer and then ...
It was like I was falling for ever, and ever and ever and then a moment came when just opened up and...
AS) ...everything just opened up.
A) Everything opened, everything opened and there was...
I mean, when I start speaking of this I feel like... You know it's not about a spiritual experience, this realization, but in that moment it was a spiritual experience!
AS) What was exactly?
A) Everything opened up as light!
AS) You saw that: as light.
A) As light, everything was light, everything was just full of ...hmmm, you can call it bliss, but that's not the experience of...
AS) You mean the prison, the guards, the prisoners, everything...
A) ...everything was gone . I was just...it was like I dropped in my experience and consciousness opened, opened, opened, opened, opened, opened, opened, opened, opened, opened and I knew that I was free.
And in my interpretation, of my mind, when the mind came back, was that I now had found a place where I could go.
AS) So the mind was done and you were floating in bliss, there...or...
A) There was only That! I wasn't floating in it.
AS) There was only...there was no you...
A) ...only That. And so, when the mind start...at the same moment there was like: " what's this?", yeah?
And I just kept letting go and kept happening into that, and there was this experience of...all through the body, a kind...a bliss!
No pain. And so it was like I had found a place where I could go, so every day, I started dropping to that place!
AS) And you had to go to work?
A) Yeah.
AS) And while you were in the factory...
A) The next morning when I woke up the was no more frantic mind of whrha.....
There was the recognition of a beautiful sun rising, this amazing moment; and the joke of these uniforms, and the joke of the guards screaming. There was a smile inside that I knew that nothing could touch, nothing could take and in that there was a peace that I knew could never be locked up, and could never be taken away, nothing could...
AS) So didn't matter if you were in prison or not in prison...
A) ...didn't matter anymore: I wasn't in prison anymore.
The walls of the cell were no longer a boundary.
And from that day on started like... every day, every day was an opening and it was as if there was like, in my chest, like... bursting with love.
And where was this love coming from? I didn't have any idea of: "oh, this is awakening" or "this is anything"...I just was shifting...
AS) ...it was just a sensation...
A) ...shifting, and this burst of love was there, it was like I was ... everybody in the planet...
I was love for everybody in the planet: for the guards, for every prisoner, for everything: love was just exploding.
And each day, realizations were happening, coming through.
This was like not one moment of a shift...it was then for a period of months following, deepening and opening, of...
AS) Is still happening?
A) Not like that, no.
AS) That was a crack.
A) That was what I would call a spiritual...
AS) ...awakening...
A) ...a shift, an experience which many people go through when they open up as That.
AS) As pure consciousness or whatever you want to call That, in a way.
A) Yes: I was experiencing myself as That and the experience of me was happening in That. That's still happening...
AS) The experience of you as this...
A) ...little victim...
AS) ...or this little individual within the walls...
A) ...being locked up in prison was just like...
AS) ...that was a little thing compared to the big thing?
A) Yes. There was no longer a victim story going on. There was the beauty of...
AS) ...existence..
A) ...yes, yes and it was pouring in day after day after day: revelation.
It was just pouring in.
And this went on for months and months and of course I had the great illusion that the thing I wanted most was to get out of there and back...
AS) ...back to your own self, right?
A) Back to England, right? To get out of that... still I had that illusion!
AS) Still, even though you were having that other thing you were having this other...
A) Still there was the belief that...
They don't tell you the date when you're going to get out; it's a complete shock!
AS) I see; you knew only you were in there about three years...
A) Yes.
AS) So you didn't know. So...
A) ...so, the day when I came out and came back, it was the greatest disappointment! (laughs)
AS) It was? (laughs) You were having these ongoing revelations and then you were released at somewhere along...
A) Yes, I was released.
AS)....something used in prison, you had this...What was disappointing? 'cause it wouldn't matter...
A) Because I was always having this great experience of existence, the miracle itself was happening here and all I could see was people running with their hra hr hra, and in their stories and not noticing the miracle and when I came back my parents started to call me by the name they gave me and the personality started arising.
AS) You were able to witness all this?
A) All of it! All of it! I saw the identity reform itself; the roles started to appear again.
AS) You saw but you didn't buy into it!
A) I knew it wasn't me! I knew it wasn't true and there was nobody that I could tell this to.
AS) You were a little familiar with the Osho tradition, but it was...
A) I was, I was very familiar!
AS) But no one described your experience as what you, as what you're saying...
A) I couldn't relate the experience I was having to what Osho was speaking of as That.
AS) You couldn't relate to anything.
A) No, it didn't look like anything. It didn't...
What I understood of enlightenment I didn't even considered that this was the shift. That was some big experience of something else.
I still had anger arising, I still had irritation, I still had all those things: how could I be.... No, I didn't even considered any of that.
AS) But what did you have along with all those things, though? You had anger, but you had this other thing.
A) I knew, I knew that all those things arising were nothing, were not anything to do with me, not me, not touching me.
AS) So do you still have the sense of that...space?
A) All that still raises, all the human...
AS) No, but the sense of this other space too, the space that can't touch... who you really are. That's where you are coming from...
A) I am That!
AS) And I guess I must be That too!
A) Absolutely!
AS) But I'm still caught in my...drama, I suppose.
A) And you see that?
AS) I see that, I do see the drama.
A) And is there any part of you that's not caught in that drama?
AS) The part that sees it is not caught in the drama at all.
A) Right. And what is here right now?
AS) The part that sees that.
A) Right, and does this come and go?
AS) Yeah, comes and goes.
A) The part that sees it comes and goes?
AS) Well, I'm not aware of it when it goes, I'm aware when it's here, but it seems to come and go because I get sucked back in to the drama.
A) You mean the awareness of awareness comes and goes?
AS) Yes.
A) And what is aware of that, that it comes and goes?
AS) Well, I only am aware once I'm back in the awareness state, so when it goes and I get pulled in...
A) Yeah.
AS) ...then I'm not aware and as soon as I'm coming out of it and I can see: oh yeah that was another...
That's what I feel comes and goes.
A) Right, but the experience, the experience is coming and going, right?
AS) Yeah, the awareness of awareness.
A) The experience of being in the awareness of awareness comes and goes, right?
AS) It comes and goes, yes, but you were saying the awareness doesn't come and go. Is that what you were saying?
A) Ok, in this moment, right, can you in this moment: you are aware of the empty space in this room?
AS) The empty space...
A) In between these two bodies.
AS) Yeah!
A) There is...appears like there is an empty space in between these two bodies, right? Does this come and go?
Even if you're not aware of it?
AS) No, I guess that doesn't come and go, does it?
It's..the awareness of that is there.
A) Right, this empty space in between these bodies: is it ever not here?
AS) No, it's here.
A) Right, even if you completely forget about it.
AS) Right, ok, I get it.
A) The thinking process is moving and you jump on that...still happening here...
AS) ...yes...
A) ...this that never moves, right?
AS)Right!
A) So, once there is a moment of... like if I ask you: in this moment where do you end and this empty space begin?
In this moment!
AS) I guess...you know if it's not my body then it's like that my awareness is also there.
A) But you are using the thinking to say "I guess" and logically, but in this moment...
AS) In this moment where do I end? I can't see where I end.
A) Right. Is there an ending of you and the beginning of this space?
AS) Is there an ending of me and the beginning of this space...
A) This empty space in between these bodies: where do you end and this empty space in between these bodies begin?
AS) I mean, I know what you are saying: I think.
A) If you can just... it's so so easy and so simple: that's why it's so difficult because, because the mind is used to...like the mind tries to get it, and the mind cannot get it. It's a moment of stopping, just one moment of stopping, one tiny moment of seeing, yeah? So if I ask you and you don't use this thinking to check for the answer...
AS) ... right, good: thank you for saying that, ok!
A) If you don't use that, if I ask you to, in this moment as we meet, we meet here, yeah, and you, you take a look, without using any thinking, you take a look: where do you end and I begin?
AS) Yeah, there is no...
A) ... there is no. You cannot find the place where you end. So this what appears like an empty space between these bodies; is formless presence; has taken a form, looks through these eyes...
AS) Oh, I get that, so that's what you are saying; the formless that exists in the emptiness is the thing that never ends. Is that what you...
A) ...are you...(indicates the head)
AS) No, I'm trying to...I mean it's just a level, a moment of realization about that; yes and then I'm thinking about it, yeah.
A) Yes, so you move. What happens is you saw it and then you immediately moved to turn it over in the...
AS) ... right, I do that...
A) ...and then you move away. That's when you move away from letting go into the seeing...
AS) So, say it again...( laughs) stay with it! I am getting what you're making me aware of: this... you know, I identify it as me but I can't say it's me the awareness, because that's seems it's much bigger than me.
A) Ok, in this moment: let's take a look right now without using the thinking, right? Where do you experience what you call me? Where is it? Can you keep the eye contact with me?
AS) Ok, yeah.
A) That way I can....
AS) You know, good, thank you, I appreciate that! So when you look at me, because when I look away I get the sense of just me...
A) ... you're going to a world...
AS) ...yeah, and I get the sense of my isolated self, but looking at you, making the eye contact...
A) ...it keeps...
AS) ... it keeps the ‘me’ in continuity with everything else.
A) In this moment, taking a fresh look right now, what is me? Can you find the quality of me?
AS) When I look at you and when I make eye contact, I can't find the quality of me-ness; it's something speaking...
A) ... yes...
AS) ...but that might be me, but it might ...it's not just me.
A) Ok, now, there is something here that is experiencing itself as you... in this body...
AS) ... I guess that's true but, yeah: that’s something I can't identify that, though.
A) Something experiencing this body.
AS) I don't know what that is.
A) Right, let's take a look, in this moment, yeah. Is that......this?
AS) Yeah...is that this...
A) ...this...this..Is this aware, right now?
AS) I think it is aware, isn't it? It is!
A) Don't think.
AS) It's aware, yeah!
A) It's aware!
AS) It's aware!
A) Right?
AS) Yes. I only go the thinking thing because...anyway, forget that
A) You see it!
AS) Yes, it is aware!
A) Aware of all the shapes in the room, the colours...
AS) Absolutely, yeah.
A) It is aware?
AS) It's aware.
A) Are you doing anything for that to be aware?
AS) No.
A) No. No. Can you in this moment just try to get rid of that? Can you get rid of that, loose it?
AS) Get rid of awareness?
A) Yeah, just get rid of it, loose it. Is it possible?
AS) I don't think so...Only if I shut it off, or if I start thinking it's probably aware.
A) But thinking will happen... in awareness...you'll be aware...
AS) ...but I can't shut off the awareness...
A) ...no, you cannot...
AS) ...I don't think so...it doesn't seem like it's possible...'cause...ok!
A) Ok.
AS) Ok, I'm following you
A) So, this is aware, you're not doing that and you can't stop it. Right?
AS) Ok, right.
A) Yeah?
AS)Yeah.
A) Yeah, so, take a look, right now, without thinking about it a thought, because you absolutely do not need a thought to know yourself. You don't need a thought; not one thought will help you, not at all.
So, this that is aware, right now, and cannot be got rid of, you don't need to try to get or keep 'cause it's here.
Is it in the body or out the body?
AS) It doesn't seem to be in the body; it seems the body is in it.
A) Yes, yes, and yet it must be also in the body if you can experience sensation, awareness.
AS) I guess, but is much bigger than the body.
A) Right; can we say it is in and out?
AS) Yes, it must be some... I know it's big. That’s what I know.
A) Ok, in this moment we are looking for the quality of me, right?
AS) Ah, ok!
A) So this that is here, this aware ... presence of being that you are doing nothing for it to be here, right? You're doing nothing for That, it simply just is, you can't get rid of it, yeah?
AS) Ok!
A) How far away from you is it?
AS) I don't even know what 'me' is when you say that.
A) Yes, that's why I'm asking you to look in this moment.
Take a look!
AS) How far away from me is it?
A) Yeah. In your experience right now...
AS) ...it's not far away at all. I mean I don' know what ‘me’ is...
A) ...that's why I'm asking you...
AS) ...I don't have a sense of ‘me’ at all in the awareness...
A) ...right, exactly. This is the whole point. So...
AS) The only thing that has a sense of 'me' is a label, a role, an identification...
A)... exactly...
AS) ...but awareness itself has no sense of ‘me’.
A) Yes, yes.
AS)Are you saying I'm enlighten...
A) ...absolutely..
AS) ...are you saying that's the enlightened experience?
A) Let's go one more step!
AS) Ok.
A) Ok. I've asked you how far from you is it? And you cannot find a' me'.
So then, in this moment, what is the difference between this that is aware and you; is there any difference, right now?
AS) I don't know what ‘me’ is, so...
A) ( Laughing and taking his hand.)
AS) ...I don't know there is a difference...
A) That's the whole point, what I point to. It's like you cannot find a 'me', you cannot find something else than this: there is only this...
AS) ...there is only that.
A) You cannot find something else. You are home!
AS) I'm home.
I’m getting it as you share it.
A) You see, if you can look, there is This that is knowing itself and then there is the idea of getting, getting something, getting it.
AS) But there is This and then there is..
A) ...what else?
AS)...disconnection from This, which then becomes 'me'.
A) Ok, in this moment, those are thoughts, all these are thoughts coming and going, these thoughts of disconnection, but when those thoughts are gone, so what is here?
AS) Just us...
I totally get that and live that and I see a role that I choose to play separately, but This can stay.
A) This is never lost, no matter what happens , This is not growing older; the body is growing older but This does not age a moment.
AS) Even without the body This is still...
A) This doesn't die, doesn't get sick...
AS) Awareness...This
A) Without naming it, just This, This...
AS) ...the presence..
A) ...This that is looking directly to itself, This that is seeing itself, it doesn't have a birth date!
AS) I do live in that state at points, but then something happens...
A) Life happens; This has seen every moment of your life; This has seen it all, nothing has been hidden from This, This has seen it all. Has seen all the ups and downs, the joy, the pain, but This itself has never been in pain.
AS) This is the observer of all that, just a pure observance.
A) Even before we gave it a name, just....It knows itself in this moment. Once we have seen This, that This is what I am, I'm not all that story, This is what I am, then all the story needs to come, everything needs to come, it needs to come to be clarified, from this point, it needs to be seen from this point.
AS) I’ve been to this place, I know it...
A) You can't get away...
AS) But then I come back in to the world and ...
A) ...nothing happens..
AS)...no, but I forget it..I ignore it...I don't ...what did you say, value it..That’s the big..You value this... awareness. It's simple, isn't it?
A) Absolutely, so simple, it's so simple.
AS) It's just awareness, pure awareness.
A) Yeah, absolutely...
AS)...and that's all it is, is everything and nothing in a sense...
A) Absolutely! It knows itself by itself
AS) Is it it that knows itself?
A) If we do not use any words right now, what is here knowing itself?
AS)I don't know what it is, but I am it, I'm part of it and we are connecting in it.
A) Yes, This is never hurt. I have the all human experience, I have all the triggers, all the memory-body is full of all the behaviour patterns, all the old stories, all the emotional body: it gets triggered, the whole thing comes, mind plays, just like you...
AS) It does!
A) Absolutely, it all plays...
AS)...and you're acted out as well
A) ...it's like, I would say that it comes to be seen by That, and in the seeing there is a clarification. It's like just unfinished business playing out, whatever is still unconscious in the system will arise to be seen...
AS) And This then sees it...
A) This has seen this moment happen, This has seen us sitting in the chair, having this talk.
It sees, and the more that comes in to consciousness, the more the lights are on. It's like walking in a room with the lights on: everything is being seen so it doesn't take you.
And it's an ongoing moment to moment inquiry that’s going on by itself...
AS) But you were saying when you get a trigger... what happens, what happens to This for you?
A) To This nothing happens
AS) But how you act in the triggering of those patterns?
A) Ok, if it is a trigger of, let's say anger or irritation, I will just stop and experience the sensation moving through the body as a sensation, without being 'me'-who-is-angry-because...
S) So you don't act it out, you just...
A)Acting out can happen, it can happen, but it's not 'somebody' acting it out.
AS) It takes practice, in a sense, familiarizing...
A) In the beginning... I would say it's very very different now to when it was in the beginning, because in the beginning there was a complete acting out and it was like there was this recognition, and there the old play of personality, separate.
AS)...and now?
A) Now it's more all together, is all more integrated, like it's all happening in the same moment. In those days it was more like I was either in the recognition, or in the ...caught up.
AS) You are making me now recognize something, you're helping me to see awareness.
A) What you recognize?
AS) I recognize it's always been there and I've always known that it's been there.
A) Yes.
AS) But I haven't acknowledged what I always known.
A) Exactly, exactly.
AS) And I may go back to the world and forget that...or not..(laughs). I don't know but I have recognized before that I had forgotten, yeah...
A) Yes, what is the most important thing for you in this life?
AS) I don't know...I mean, in this awareness? I don't....
A) If you are going to die next week what would be the...
AS) .....I used to think relationship, or something like that...I don't know: does it matter?
A) No...
AS) ..So..
A) ... but it's like what is the most strongest desire, the most important thing, that is what you're going live, you know, that's where your attention goes.
AS) Whatever is the most important thing!
A) To the thing that causes your attention most!
AS) How do we go beyond that? I mean how these things stay in awareness? Because right now none of it it's important.
A) Right.
AS) So when we are back in the personality the important thing rises up for us to...
A) ...no, for myself is the thing that is the most love of my life is to be always in truth, to be always living in alignment with what is truly... truly just feels true! Yeah, that's the most important thing for me.
Like I wouldn't want to be living in a way where all my system was not aligned with the love of my life, which is to be in the true meeting, yeah.
AS) So what you do is just bring this awareness to people?
A) It looks like that, yeah.
AS) It's simple in a way...
A) It's so simple, it's my passion because it's so simple and it's so immediate, and then comes what follows after a recognition: is all the mind's illusion is not cleared up. A lot of illusion leftover in the mind level with yes-but, yes-but...yes, but when I'm in my relationship, but when I'm this, when I'm there when I'm here., when this happend I loose it....all that is illusion and so these groups are here for clearing up, liberate the mind.
AS) All these gathering groups that then help each other reflect...
A) The groups are, like I always...usually I ask to do an individual session with each, each one and get a clear stopping of the mind...
AS) Like this type of thing (between us)?
A) More, going more deeply, it's like having ...
AS) Can you go deeper...?
A) ...I have a little process I use that and I don't really don't want...
AS) ...you don’t like to share it..
A)... to do that on film.
AS) It’s Ok!
A) But I would do that...
AS) ...with me..
A) Yes! Absolutely, I would love to!
AS) It's a process that makes the state....
A) Well it makes a very clear stopping of the mind and a clear seeing because also a lot of words come that clear something of the mind and then I invite those people to come together in a group who all already have the stopping of the mind moment; and then all the yes-but,...when-I'm-in-my-drama, when-this-happens, all the yes-buts come from each one and each one can see that what happens there happens here, what happens there happens here, it's all the same story, all the same illusion, all the same mind, all the same one, and sometimes it's easier to see it when it's happening ( in a group).
And in that... my experience in these groups is that layers come off. We actually go through and encounter what's rising in the moment.
AS) And the idea is to live in this space always?
A) Well, you are, you already are.
AS) Yes, I get that.
A) You can't get out of it but to wake up in this moment to moment to moment requires that you, that this is the most important thing to you, that you look in every moment that rises in the drama that you are always looking for what is real and what is true. But this happens by itself, is not something with your mind you can say: ok, I'll do that.
AS) So, meditation and all that is an avoidance in a sense of what is just here!
A) I would say that it gives a great ground, meditation. When I meet people who have been meditating, if they haven't got identified with the meditator, then they already have, they already know what people calls this space; they already know so well, 'cause it is, you know in meditation they tell you to become the witness, but you already are the witness.
AS) That the sense I get that in meditation...
A) ...if the mind is trying to become This, it's impossible. But meditation is not out of place.
AS) It's sitting with the awareness...That's what I get.
A) It's developing the knack of watching the mind.
One thing more I would like to say, it's not about escaping from all that arises, it’s really really about coming fully into all that arises and meeting every moment fully like being willing to experience every moment fully. And what part of you can say yes to that?
AS) I guess all of it has... I have to say yes to it.
A) Yes: there's one part of you that can say yes?
AS) One part can say yes to experiencing it fully?
A) Every moment.
AS) Yes.
A) One place in you can say yes to every moment...
AS) The place where it arises from!
A) Yes.
AS) And we do not have a choice in a sense, 'cause...
A) ...and there is nobody.
AS) And there is nobody...?
A) ...to make a choice. There is only This.
AS) So this plays and creates that for the play, or... it' doesn't matter, really.
A) If we want to talk like that we can say many things.
AS) It doesn't matter.
A) What matters more than anything is this direct meeting. It speaks louder than all.
AS) So when you first had This, you didn't know what it was, but when did you get what it was?
A) I started listening to Gangaji, when I came back from Japan, and I started hearing:' This is what's happening here'. But still it wasn't complete clarification, still I was, what people says to me now, in and out of that realization. Then I came to Dolano, and I was in a three week intensive and on the first day, when she started to speak about 'who am I' , in the first session....bang!
AS) You got it!
A) It was clear! This is it, this is it, this is it, then I knew that this was what had been... It was the realization of the realization of the realization. Like no way to turn away.
AS) So, you have reminded me of something...
A) What was it?
S) Awareness. You know, you've connected me to something here. I'm remembering...there is no word to that. It's for me, after living, remembering, bringing value...doing something than I normally, usually do with the...
A) ...Sometimes I say that you need to fall in love...
AS) ...with This...
A) ...yes: This is the beloved, This is the beloved...
AS) ...it's so simple..
A) ...when you've find the beloved, you don't want to be far away for too long.
AS) Thank you.
A) Thank you!
AS) Do you have a website?
A) Www.satsangananta.com ; I’m not very good at it!
AS) Don’t worry...
AS) As we disengage I found myself coming back into a 'me' persona: what do you tell people about that?
A) This is it, don't try to get away from that; this is the human experience.
AS) I love this other part too...
A)...but they don't go anyway, it doesn't go anyway: it's all at the same time. It's This that is playing out as me. It is not something else; this was the biggest shock from my mind. Later, was that "Oh my God, it's me", me who has been searching for That.
AS) Awareness is you...
A) It's me, it was me all along, there is no other; so now it's playing as little me, little english, little crazy personality here: it's playing as that, is playing as Alan here, (as the people here around) is playing itself through form; there is nothing else.
AS)Yeha, it’s good isn’t it? ( To people in the room) Did you get that? It’s amazing, so simple as well! She’s a good reminder! No, I really ...I’ve got it!
You could see that, right?
A) Yes, I can see it, now...
AS)... ok, good!
A) It’s not in the past,
S) I always had it, know I would have this awareness of awareness all the time.
A) You are in love with it, that’s why you’re interviewing people, that’s why you’re interviewing people in This...
AS)... I guess I am...
A) ...’cause you are drawn to This, you’re in love with This, you want to be in the play of bringing This to light, otherwise....It’s playing that through you!
AS) It is ?
A) Yes, you’re doing a great job, thank you!
AS) Really merge with someone, in that awareness, it become...there only is...
A) One!
AS) ...one being, and that’s just awareness.
A) Yes; this is the true meeting. Much better than drugs!
AS) Much higher than drugs, isn't it?
A) Yes, you don't come down.
AS) When you find this you do not need drugs.
A)That’s it!
AS) It' s actually what drugs are looking for.
A) Absolutely, now I know that I was searching This through the drugs.
AS)...'cause this is much more addictive....(Laughs) And that.............. your body, mind and spirit...
A) ...this is the nourishment, yeah.
AS) But it's not immediately addictive, it hasn't immediately ....be loved, until you realize...
A)...until you test it more and more, and you don't settle for less, you cannot.
AS) Nothing to do with.... It's a unique expression...
I've talked to a lot of people: you have made it very simple!
A) It's time for that...It's time for simplicity.
AS) It is, it has to be. It's nothing more than just awareness; awareness of awareness; that's...
A)...and even to say just awareness, I mean, it's....it’s the miracle that is playing this all play.
AS) Thank you
A) Thank you, I've enjoyed it very much.
AS) I've enjoyed it too. ( to the operators ) Was it a good transmission?
O1) Yes, it was amazing! O2) Didn’t need pop corn!
AS) Yes, it was very engaging! You do this with everyone? This is what you do!?
A) Yes. It depends on the openness.
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